Help, I am trapped in modern psychology. What would Rene Guenon advise?

Discussion in 'Religion & Spirituality' started by InternetDarkAge, 12 July 2018.

  1. Rene Guenon views modern psychology as superfluous at best, and very dangerous black magic at worst -- that is perhaps a given. I am not asking this question for the conclusion. What I am looking for is the deeper explanation, which involves the subtle order of things influencing the corporeal world.

    I hope my question is not too vague. I am mired in confusion over these matters and am desperately looking for answers. I fear that after nearly a decade of being an enthusiast of psychology, and self-identifying as "socially anxious", that it has blinded me to the real reason why people cause me stress and panic. During this time, I fervently believed that thinking my way out of stress and panic, silently debating in endless self-dialogue, silently debating the "irrationality" of such a fear, would eventually, one day, lead me to peace. What a disaster!

    I fear I've lost the path back to reality. Having adopted the airs, the vocabulary, the rituals of psychology, and having bound myself to this frame of mind so completely, I feel terror at the possibility that I have sealed myself shut in an illusory world, from which there is no escaping.

    What is left for a man who took the wrong path, and who, like Dante, has gotten lost in a dark forest? Sometimes I think if I retrace my steps by examining my history, this will be a sufficient starting point to an effective explanation. But is this really possible? Could Dante simply retrace his steps (a decade worth of steps, in my case) to retrieve the forest entrance? Or have things degenerated to such an extent that even this is impossible?

    What is the way forward?

    Thank you.
    • Like Like x 1
  2. UPDATE:
    These concerns recently arose after beginning to read Guenon's "The Reign of Quantity and the Signs of the Times". I posted this topic yesterday when my terror and confusion were reaching feverishness. Today I reached Chapter 34, "The Misdeeds of Psychoanalysis", and Mr. Guenon's explanation of things has had an effect on me. The confusion does not seem as insoluble.

    I do not know what was intended with this topic -- again, this was posted in a rather feverish state --, but if anyone reads this and is facing a comparable dilemma, perhaps we can begin a correspondence to discuss these things in more detail.

    Thank you.
    Last edited: 14 July 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  3. fschmidt

    fschmidt Senior Member

    I am not a fan of Rene Guenon, but I would say that any traditional religion should work as a cure for your issue.
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Myrddin

    Myrddin Senior Member

    • Interesting Interesting x 1
  5. Hrogar

    Hrogar Senior Member

    Confusion means old frames of mind being broken by thoughts and ideas that ask for a reframing. But body and mind can not be seperated without the both growing out of sync. That is why mere contemplation is a dead end, and why mere physical training is also a dead end. Thought and action only have value when both are aligned.

    Isn't it correct that it's not per se 'people' who cause your a stress and panic, but your own idea that your life should be socially embedded or that it even should be the opposite of what people think? Both end up in heavy dependency on popular consensus of what life is or should be about. These issues can be viewed both from a psychological and traditional point of view. As an example, both Jung and Evola view a (negative or positive) dependency on 'others' as a bad thing, albeit both for different reasons.

    One of the most interesting and valuable ideas in psychology is Jung's idea of the Shadow, the Self and the Persona. This can be used very well together with traditional practices. Both psychology (at least the healthier parts of it) and traditionalism only work when thought and action are in sync.
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Meditation first. Self-knowledge later. You are desperately looking for the knowledge of the Self. There's Truth inside you. You must just remember. And don't worry. These struggles are necessary.

    I agree that a traditional religion would indeed help, if practiced properly and thoroughly. Also, keep reading Guénon, that man is definitely inducing metanoia to those sufficiently prepared.
    Last edited: 8 August 2018
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Guenon's words are so palpably felt. They do not mince themselves with soft rhetoric. By soft rhetoric I mean the form most popular nowadays, which must always come with a safety valve, an out, which when turned relieves the mounting pressure. In this way, danger is not allowed to achieve an objectivity. Safety is always there as the veil when things become uncomfortable. In popular rhetoric this veiling is like a trance, in which words are seeking to dissipate energy rather than concentrate it. Guenon's discourse brings the energy to such a concentration that, if his reader has any significant deficiencies and his reader does not seek dissipation elsewhere (for Guenon's works certainly do not dissipate themselves), the inner-crises are brought to the forefront. This is one way I relate my experience of Guenon's work.
    Metanoia indeed.
    • Like Like x 2
  8. This is well put. This has given me an important starting point for reflection.

    Thank you.
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Praetor

    Praetor Senior Member

    It is true that Guenon's judgement of psychology and psychoanalysis was categorically negative, however he refers chiefly to the theories of Freud. Later, Evola would also provide a lengthy critique of psychoanalysis (just published by Arktos, in fact, in The Mask and Face of Contemporary Spiritualism).

    However, if you are facing difficulties, perhaps it is best not to dwell on such matters, and if you are unable to be stoic, then there are other methods which will be of help, without resorting to Woody Allen-like levels of rumination.
    Take a look at these recent articles, which will no doubt be of some help:
  10. Thank you for your response.
    Since posting this thread, I have read Evola's "Doctrine of Awakening", a work that distills the canonical works of Buddhism into certain practices and principles that are universal to traditional systems. Applying it as a way of life has changed a lot in a short amount of time.
    A small warning about the articles posted: They do not shy away from, and, in fact, openly endorse, techniques that are readily seen to be mental gymnastics. One of the articles goes so far as to celebrate various kinds of distraction as an effective tool (a mental sleight of hand). In matters of spirit, there is no trick that will overcome the elementary forces, both subtle and overt, in play.
    On the other hand, traditional Buddhism begins its endeavors by organically reorienting the mind, placing it once again in the cavern of the heart. Buddhism does offer many mental techniques, but these are all seated within a larger system aiming to fundamentally reawaken the inner being. Application of mental techniques is merely a beginning stage within a beginning stage (or a preparation) to the traditional Buddhist. When isolated and viewed as an end in itself, such a practice is likened to the act of yelling to try and drown out the echo, or cutting air with a sword.
    Psychological therapy does (and must do in order to affect change) take this stage in isolation. This is very dangerous. It is a cul-de-sac that a man can run around in, trapped, until the day he dies. The longer he runs in this cul-de-sac, he will begin to forget the road back out. He is isolated in the worst way possible. Believing himself to be efficacious with mental gymnastics, he at last comes to be reigned in and ridden by the unconscious.
    Coping with the modern world through the modern world is the focus of psychological therapy. And it will be a disaster to anyone who takes this as their mental vocation.
    Overcoming the modern world through transcending it is the true aim.
    Last edited: 28 December 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice